Please tell me “someone” is responsible for all this…

Posted : August 25, 2004 at 10:38 pm [America/Los_Angeles]

As of 08/25/2004 (10:30 PM PST)…


Total US soldiers wounded : 6690


p.s.

Data on the total number of soldiers from other coalition countries that were wounded in Iraq was not available

- Anand

Viewed: 1011 times

11 Comments

There is someone responsible. Sadam.

I hope you aren’t trying to pin those deaths on George Bush.

Posted by: Erik Weibust at August 26, 2004 @ 6:10 am

You bet some of it is President Bush’s fault!

You can’t have it both ways - collect all the kudos when the “actual” war went well and NOT hold yourself accountable for the things that did not go well! You’re the commander-in-chief, for crying out loud.

US had all the right in the world to go in and take out Al Qaeda and Talibans in Afghanistan. And they did! Did we have the world with us when we went in there? You betcha. Did it cost US taxpayers that much? Nope. Are the soldiers protecting Afghanistan considered “occupiers”? Nope. Why? Because, the world sided with us, helped us and continues to help us, especially with “nation building” and “winning the peace”. That’s why you have merely 11,000 US soldiers in Afghanistan, less than the number of cops we have in New York (I think).

I don’t care what the pundits say, I was around when we went to Iraq war. Anyone trying to tell me that there was “no other way” to deal with Saddam is being disingenuous. There were plenty of different ways of doing this. Our commander-in-chief chose a certain way. The “cowboy” way, if you ask me.

The war was flawlessly executed. Kudos to the commander-in-chief. He “chose” to take this short lasting moment of success to get in a flight-suit and show off his leadership by declaring Mission Accomplished. And you know what, I will give him that. Way to go, Mr. President!!

Ofcourse, little did we know that just about everything else was not “planned” for. “We will be welcomed as saviors.” That’s it. That was the plan!

We took out Saddam’s sons fairly quickly. We even took Saddam into captivity by Dec. 2003. So, are we done? Far from it. In fact, if anything, our soldiers and guards there are stuck! This is precisely, what folks who opposed the war feared would happen, especially with no “real” world support for the pre-emptive war, but more importantly, for the “peace efforts” afterwards. Even the former president, George H.W. Bush had feared this outcome back in 1991 (see an earlier post for details).

US soldiers continue to die on a daily basis, even under an interim Iraqi government. We’ve burned our bridges with NATO and other nations around the world so much that they continue to shy away from this “mess”. And you can’t blame them.

The fact is that the US tax-payers (people like you and me) continue to pay, almost exclusively, for this war. Is this also Saddam’s fault? Who planned it all out? Who ratified those plans? Did anyone have any contingencies, any backup plan? It’s lame to just blame everything under the sun on the “intelligence officials” or “Al Qaeda” or “Saddam”

So, yes, some of this is President Bush’s fault. There are things that he did right. And I applaud him for it. However, I am not married to every decison that he takes, you know..;-) I get to pick on him when he screws up. And you bet he screwed up here. Screwed up big time!

If the US government was a business, the entire top management would be held accountable. People would laugh if the CEO said, “But, it’s the others who screwed me up! They gave me incorrect information”.

I am sorry to say this, but the war in Iraq was a war of “choice”. Not one soul (in US or the world) protested the war against Talibans and Al Qaeda in Afghanistan. However, we all know what happened when this administration chose to adopt a doctrine of pre-emptive war. The first time ever in US history had a President of United States done this. We did not adopt this even after Pearl Harbor. We did not have the US President at the time saying, “Look, I can’t trust any country which has a significant Japanese population. We’ll pre-emptively go after them, come what may”.

We all know a guy named Osama Bin Laden brought 9/11 hell on the doorsteps of US. Plain and simple. There isin’t and never was “any” link between 9/11 and Saddam. However, we chose to (and continue to choose to) think that there was one. Saddam was not an imminent threat. But this administration (and the world’s intelligence I might add) “erroneously” thought he was.

However, even if I side with the administration and give them a pass on the faulty intelligence and assume that the “Iraq war” was indeed absolutely necessary, they still need to be held accountable for “how” they planned for the actual war and the “peace” afterwards. This was their choice. And you know what, they “screwed” up. Saddam DID NOT cause US to exclusively spend 120 billion dollars on this war. Saddam DID NOT arm-twist President Bush to go at it by alienating major NATO and UN allies. Saddam did not make President Bush say to the world (not in so many words though), “It’s my way or it’s the highway.” That was a choice. President Bush’s choice. And he was wrong.

Was it all worth it? Well, even if I sided with the pro-war camp for a fleeting second, I would still say - “Nope, not all of this was worth losing over Saddam.” Bottomline, in my humble opinion, there “must” have been a better way of doing this. When 10,000 innocent civilians get killed as a collateral damage, there must be something wrong.

So, yes, Saddam is not the only one responsible for all of this. As the captain of the ship, the commander-in-chief, President Bush owes an explanation to the many who died and the umpteen whose lives changed forever because of the choices he made.

Moral of the story (for President Bush and Company):


You and your military might (your precision-guided missiles) can win a war in a hurry against any nation. And do it almost WITHOUT ANYONE’S HELP. However, if you plan on winning the peace, do some nation building, your military might ain’t gonna help. You’ll have to do that the old fashioned way. By winning people’s hearts. And, you “will” need friends. Really good friends. You will need the world’s support, Mr. President! Funny thing is, just ask your dad. He knows it better than you do.”

Erik, you should not let your political affiliations cloud your judgement here. Imagine what would you say if John Kerry or Bill Clinton were the president today and overseeing this mess. Would you still think that it was all for a just cause and done exactly right. Just think about it.

Posted by: Anand Sharma at August 26, 2004 @ 10:01 am

Anand,

First, I love these kind of “debates”. I wish I had enough time to give you a quality response like you gave my comment. Please take no disrespect in the length of my comment.

I’ll give a few quick points for you to ponder.

Saddam had been breaking, disobeying, “insert the appropiate word here” the UN resolutions on inspections, etc. That had been put in place after the first Iraq War and I believe there were others put in place much later. Bush acted on what the UN was supposed to do. I’m glad the US stood by the rules the UN put in place. It is truly a shame, in my opinion, the way the UN handled this. Allowing Saddam to push them around and make them look like fools. “OK Saddam, we really mean it this time, you better let us come inspect your country”. There were numerous occasions where he “walked all over” the UN.

I have no problem with there being troops in Iraq. It is 2004 and we still have how many troops in Germany? When did World War II end? When did the Cold War end? Why aren’t people complaing about this? How many troops are in Japan? When did WW2 end? Again, people aren’t protesting that. Why not?

Wasn’t Kerry in favor of the US going to war with Iraq? When and why did his opinion change. If I remember correctly Bush got permission for this.

Thanks for the open debate on these issues.

Erik

Posted by: Erik Weibust at August 26, 2004 @ 11:37 am

I am sure you’ve plenty to do than to sit and spend time responding to my blog entries. What I am trying to say is, thanks for participating..:-)

You raise good points. I will try to respond really quickly:

1.

You said…
Saddam had been breaking, disobeying, “insert the appropiate word here” the UN resolutions on inspections, etc. That had been put in place after the first Iraq War and I believe there were others put in place much later. Bush acted on what the UN was supposed to do. I’m glad the US stood by the rules the UN put in place. It is truly a shame, in my opinion, the way the UN handled this. Allowing Saddam to push them around and make them look like fools. “OK Saddam, we really mean it this time, you better let us come inspect your country”. There were numerous occasions where he “walked all over” the UN.

As I alluded to in my response, Erik, I am going to side with you (albeit for a fleeting moment) that indeed “US” had to use force against Iraq. Fine, so Iraq needed to be taught a lesson. Forget about WMD for a second. Even then, I am sure you will agree that more could have been done to get the major NATO and other UN allies to see our point of view. I for one believe that it would have been in the best interests of United States and Iraq if President Bush would have done ASOLUTELY EVERYTHING in his power (face-to-face conversation with French President in France, with Germany’s chancellor in Germany etc.) to show the world what his view point was. The fact that he understood the concerns that these countries had about a pre-emptive strike. To explain to whosoever would listen why he felt it was absolutely necessary to launch a war. Basically, he should have used all his “personal” charm (and not just send Colin Powell a gazillion times) to make the world see that he was no “cowboy”, but a true “compassionate conservative” who had the interests of his country and this world in his heart. It probably would have pushed the war a few months out, but it would have meant a lot for the world opinion. A whole lot! And yes, you need the world on your side, especially if you’re going to be in the business of nation building. Rambo approaches work well on TV movies or in just good old war where folks fight face to face using weapons. It does not work at all to win peace. Never has, never will.

2.

You said…
I have no problem with there being troops in Iraq. It is 2004 and we still have how many troops in Germany? When did World War II end? When did the Cold War end? Why aren’t people complaing about this? How many troops are in Japan? When did WW2 end? Again, people aren’t protesting that. Why not?

Well, I think it’s asinine that US has it’s troops all over the world. However, who am I to care about that if the countries where these US soldiers are don’t care. But that’s not the point. The point is this: It’s not about troops being in Iraq. I could care less if Iraqis don’t care. It’s about US troops getting killed, getting maimed there on a daily basis that troubles me. Folks in Germany or Korea don’t kill a US soldier at the rate of one a day. Folks in Germany don’t look at US soldiers as “occupiers”. Folks in Germany don’t have to put up with Abu Ghraib type fiascos. We’re complaining because i) we think there could have been a better way (”even with a war”) to do this and ii) we still don’t see the US Administration to be doing absolutely everything in their power to make their allies and the world (not to mention, many Iraqis) see that we’re not “occupiers”, that we’re friends. US must understand that making friends and allies is as much in the interests of United States as it is for the allied country. Funny thing is violence alone will not help US achieve that goal.

3.
You said…

Wasn’t Kerry in favor of the US going to war with Iraq? When and why did his opinion change. If I remember correctly Bush got permission for this.

I have talked about it at length in this entry:

http://tinyurl.com/5bd92

First, the resolution was about - “Ok, Mr. President, the country is behind you and speaks with one voice. We give you the authority to do the right thing.” Secondly, as I have said before, it’s not just about “going to war”. It’s more about “how” you did it.

In my humble opinion, President Bush and his team surely could have done much, much better job in the way they went about executing the Iraq war, assuming that going to war in itself was the right thing to do and the jury is stil out on this one. It was an error of judgement which, in my opinion, is costing us in more ways than I would like to even count (btw, the number of US soldiers killed shot up by 3 to 970 between the time I wrote this blog entry last night and my writing this comment: http://icasualties.org/oif/)

Ok, I am exhausted and hungry too..:-) I apologize if all this flies in the face of everything that you stand for and the way you see the world around yourself. Personally, I am just sad. Sad at this whole thing and the way it all turned out. Not because I (or others like me) feared this would happen all along. Not because we are any less patriotic than folks on the other side. It’s just sad. The ultimate price that our brave soldiers are paying today is not just because of Saddam. It’s also because of error in judgement on the part of President Bush’s administration. Heck, Darfur in Sudan would have been a more humanitarian mission if that’s what these soldiers are dying for - freeing people from the tortures of an oppressive regime (http://tinyurl.com/3vfu9) .

Posted by: Anand Sharma at August 26, 2004 @ 1:52 pm

Anand,

Great points again. I’ll try to be quick and short again.

On #1. I think I’ll just say we disagree on this one. I feel Bush took his time. He made his ploy to other countires (both Germany and France among others), to the UN, and most importantly to Iraq. Yes, he didn’t personally go to these nations leaders, but he sent very senior people.

On #2. There are many, many people in Iraq that are very happy with what the US has done for them. There are many people there that don’t see us as “occupiers”. They actually appreciate what the US and our soldiers are doing and they thank them. There are numerous places on the web where you can read about soldier’s positive experiences with the Iraqi people. It’s very unfortunate that this point gets hidden, or missed by people that are against the war. Yes, there are Iraqi’s that are unhappy with us being there, but there are people in Killen, TX that are unhappy that the US has bases there. I just don’t like that argument.

On #3. You made a comment about the mission in Iraq not being for enough of a humanitarian mission, and you compared it to Darfur, Sudan. This point, to be honest, really bothers me. Please go to cnn.com or your news site of choice. I felt sick after reading article after article reporting about the abuses Saddam inflicted on his people decade after decade.

This will be my last comment on this post. I’ll let you have the last word if you would like to, this is your blog. I’m sure you’ll have another post that I can comment on. :) I did blog about this post on my site and attempted to send you a trackback ping.

Posted by: Erik Weibust at August 26, 2004 @ 2:33 pm

Nah..I hate it when talkshow hosts on radio have the last laugh, even when they’re dead wrong. So, I will refrain from that. Just thank you for your sharing your opinion..:-)

- Anand

Posted by: Anand Sharrma at August 26, 2004 @ 3:09 pm

I just love it when I find someone that can tell it like it is

I gotta say, way to go Anand, you hit the spot here

Posted by: David M. at August 27, 2004 @ 7:29 am

Thanks David!

- Anand

Posted by: Anand Sharma at August 27, 2004 @ 10:33 am

Re: An American Voter Speaks Out

“How fortunate for leaders that men do not think.”
Adolf Hitler

As we approach this presidential election, I find it more and more difficult to determine the truth I need to base my choice on. The campaigns have resorted to a mishmash of clichés, misrepresentations and psychological intimidations that capitalize on our fear and confusion. The media itself has bombarded us with undocumented facts, uninformed opinions, and quotes from the candidates taken out of context.

I have concluded that the only way we can get to a rational and objective view of the issues is to bypass the campaign ads and media spin, and communicate directly with each other as voters. The responsibility for our future rests with us as voters, and with the leaders we choose. Ultimately, our opinions rest on what we believe in at a personal level. I have taken the liberty to tell you what I believe in, knowing that you and I may differ. I encourage you to take the time between now and this election to examine and clarify your own beliefs, and to stand up for them in your vote, not only for president but in your choices for congress as well.

· I believe that we must view disagreement on policy as a valuable contribution to democracy, and that we must never seek to silence the American citizen who disagrees with his leadership by labeling him as unpatriotic. We have an obligation to speak out for what we believe.

· I believe that as a society, Americans are generous, compassionate people who abhor violence and are willing to sacrifice to help those who are suffering, whether they live in Orlando or in Baghdad, in Iowa or in Palestine. We are intelligent, creative and hard working people with a strong sense of justice. We are willing and able to fight for our country. I believe that we can win the war against terrorism, through common sense and understanding, through the ability to learn from our mistakes, though the willingness to face up to the reality of the world as it exists today, not how we wish it would be.

· I believe in tolerance. I believe in inclusiveness. I believe in common sense. I believe in intelligence and education and social responsibility. I believe we can differ in opinions and still work together as a nation.

· I condemn slander, whether it is directed against Senator Kerry, President Bush, or anyone else. I condemn lies and half-truths and innuendo. I condemn stereotyping at any level.

· I believe in the perpetuation of a powerful middle class America. I believe in protecting the ability of Americans to succeed by their own efforts. I believe that the wealthiest Americans owe their status to a constitution that protects and promotes a solid, stable segment of Americans who work for wages.

· I believe a good economy is based on producing and selling quality goods and services to consumers who are able to earn the money to buy them. The ‘American Dream’ is not based on winning the lotto, it is based on the willingness to work for what we get.

· I believe the American system of public education is the foundation for our society. I believe that it is an honor as an American taxpayer to support it. I believe we should be very cautious about placing responsibility for American public education in the hands of unregulated, unaccountable for-profit organizations, or schools that promote specific religious beliefs.

· I believe in the innate ability of the American people to make compassionate and sensible choices for their own lives. I believe strongly in separation of church and state. I believe we must exercise grave caution in legislating decisions that limit our personal choices.

· I believe our country faces a grave challenge in protecting our way of lives from extremism. I believe that it is going to test our values and our reasoning as individuals and as a society. Three years after 9-11, most Americans remain confused about the cause of the attacks. I do not believe that terrorism can be explained by saying “They’re doing this because they hate freedom”. It is a complex global problem that seriously threatens our way of life. It must be approached with gravity, rationality, and commitment at a personal level from every American citizen to find its causes in order to eliminate its means.

· I believe that we need thoughtful, unbiased leadership. We need facts. We need intelligent, competent answers to issues of complexity. We need a policy that can adapt to changes of circumstances at a moment’s notice. We need to avoid paranoia and impulsive action, and approach our problems with well informed, well thought out responses to the reality of the world we are living in and the world we are handing down to our children.

Thank you for my freedom of speech. Please vote.

Posted by: Patricia at October 9, 2004 @ 8:27 am

Thank you!!

- Anand

Posted by: Anand Sharma at October 9, 2004 @ 11:35 am

Check out a site dedicated to the absurdity and satire nature of saying “It’s All George Bush’s Fault!”

http://www.itsallgeorgebushsfault.com

Regards,
Notta Libb

Posted by: Notta Libb at December 15, 2005 @ 3:51 am